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Its Better - (Rock - Keys, Lead Guitar)

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67 comments:

dbuck said...

I was hoping we might get some other talent from fjam to audition but I guess not. Looks like we need a kick in the butt for this project. I think some keys would fit this song.
I'll lay down some lead. might help.

Keeper said...

dbuck said...
I was hoping we might get some other talent from fjam to audition but I guess not. Looks like we need a kick in the butt for this project. I think some keys would fit this song.
I'll lay down some lead. might help.

---------------------------------

Ummm what kind of talent Don? Keys? I don't remember if we sent out any mass invitations for this or not. We have an archive of what has been sent out via google. I'll check and see what has been sent. If we haven't sent one out for keys for this, we can do that, but I recommend we wait until we get everything real tight before doing that. If you work on the leads, I'll put some more effort into doing a few more takes on the vocals. We'll bring everything together, and tighten it up and then put out a mass invite... I have an ace in the hole for keys. If I know the key, and chords, I can almost guarantee I can do some acceptable keys via programming. I have some excellent tools for this. If I didn't tell you you'd not know it was programmed. I just need that info... I could even audition leads if I have the right info. Maybe trade off with some guitar leads...

I'll hit the leads hard tomorrow a.m.


P.S. did you notice the streaming radio I have in place now Don? It's coming from your server... Thanks again for sharing that resource with us!

dbuck said...

No problem keeper. Look forward to a very good new year and some cool presents.
I just thought I'd give this project a kick in the butt. I have some lead ideas I have recorded. I'll upload.

Keeper said...

(Revised version)

It's better to say nothing, and to get it right
It's better to be silent, than to start a fight

I don't want to be misunderstood, by my good intentions
It's better to be careful, and forget to write

Chorus

I'm not so ignorant
I can admit when I'm wrong
I'm not too blind
To see what's going on

(solo) Sometimes you just gotta think, and not put your heart on the line

It's better not to question, what is going on
Sometimes it's less stressful, to just let things roll

It's better to be peaceful, and to dream it's right
It's better to acquire taste for the good things in life

Chorus

Repeat vesrses 1 & 2

Keeper said...

LOL It's not that easy to schedule quiet time to record!! This beagle puppy we have here is howling his head off, because we have him in his kennel! I'm looking for my time!

Keeper said...

Well I snuk in a 2nd vocal harmony in between the beagle howls here... Damned puppy!

I like the harmonies than the high part alone. I have more ideas, but I'll have to work on it some more when time permits. With these freakin' dogs here who knows when that'll happen... heheh I'll keep looking for my opportunities...

My wide is an animal nut, and has a freakin zoo here. Maybe I'll go for some sustain keys while I wait for enough silence to record... I'm going to have my youngest son take the beagle with him this weekend when he goes to his girl's house.

I want to redo the high part too. Certain word I don't like the way I sing them. Like the "w" in a few of my words...


The drum rolls are peaking too, and need to be EQed....

Keeper said...

Oh I should have told ya to look in the manager for IB2vox mix. I'll redo the highs tomorrow. or maybe later tonight if I'm lucky...

dbuck said...

My wife has a dog. A silky. His name is gibson and he follows me were ever I go. I have the same problem when I go to record. But gibson wants jump in my lap if I'm sitting or just stand there stairing and pawing me if I play standing up. He's not a pup so I try and record when its his down time. I very well understand were you are comeing from.
I also have another problem and its with my recording setup. I think its a bad cable. I'm goin look into it this weekend.
I did get an intro lead take that I'm happy with. I also did a solo lead, but not to happy with it. I'll upload them and you can play with it.

Keeper said...

Don-

I want to have a go at programming some keys. Can you please tell me what key this is in and go through the chords again? Thanks...

dbuck said...

key of F#m
Basic structure is F#m - A - D - F#m
Chorus structure is B - D - A - F#

Keeper said...

Find IB_2vocs_mix2.mp3 in the manager..

I have a few tricks up my sleeve. I will re-mix with fresh ears. It's been a long day at the console...

dbuck said...

I have a mix with the lead idea I have been working up. I'll upload "mixlead"

Keeper said...

Don-

If you trust my judgement on my edits, send up your lead track, and I'll put it in. I'm sure you noticed I edited your intro, and added a note, and otherwise edited it. If you don't mind me doing this sort of thing to your leads, send up your separate.

The ability to edit like this means you don't have to get a take perfect for us to use it. You should do sme more takes and send up the mixes, and separates too. I can use them all over the place.

Keeper said...

Ok I did a new mix today, with fresh ears. It's top file in the manager.

I still have some work to do on the pitchof the high harmony. I may need to retrack that one. Will decided after I add another harmony part, and see how well I do on the pitch edits.

I added a chorus to Don's rythm guitar. It seems to have helped the "intonation" between it and the bass when the intro comes back in.

I have more parts in mind (keys mainly). You should hear improvements in the overall mix with each passing day.

dbuck said...

I dont mind if you slice and dice. I had a brownout while recording that session. So I dont know if I have that same lead, But its no problem to do it agian in the same structure. I can play lead thru the whole song and let you slice and dice what you want. I'll see if that lead got saved. Also it needs to be inserted cause I didnt record for it to line up. I was getting ideas.

dbuck said...

were in luck. thanks for the restore session.
Yes I did notice the extra you added in the intro lead. Thats cool with me. I had played the lead both ways but I just felt it added tension to the intro by leaving it out. I have no problem with it. Plus you've added a lot with your vocals. I'm likeing what I hear. I'll whip up some filler leads and I hope you can do somethig with the main solo. It is no problem for me to redo it if you cant use it.

Keeper said...

dbuck said...
I can play lead thru the whole song and let you slice and dice what you want.
__________________________________



Yeah I like that idea Don. I could use some more to work with. I'd like to make a suggestion if I may. I know in the scales you will have to work your way up and down, both, but I'd like to see you spend more time in the upper registers. You only went into those upper registers a little bit on this last upload you sent. Most of it is in the lower registers (octaves), and that is in the same area as the rythm you did. If you play in the upper registers more it tends to contrast the rythm where it doesn't if you are in the same area as the rythm playing...

Thanks...

Keeper said...

IB_mix_12_16.mp3

I did a little experimenting with the lead guitars...

dbuck said...

I can do past the 12th if you want. Been busy this weekend so it might be a day or 2.
One thing I do if the insturments are fighting for sonic room is to give them each their own seperate freq in the EQ. Takes a little more work but I've had good results.

Keeper said...

Sure, I know about EQ, but it also helps if the instruments are playing in different areas. Listening to this, I liked your higher leads much better against the rythm guitar. I know you have to go down the scale sometimes, but when you play entire passages (phrases) in the lower registers, they fight for the room. EQ will only help this so much...

Have a listen to my last mix and see if you don't agree...

BTW: You can do you own mix when we get this finished...

I was trying to soften up my vocals and I think I may have them a little muddy in the last mix, but that's easy enough to put back. Some of that is from mixing when fatigued. When we get to the final stage, I'll be mixing with fresh ears...

Keeper said...

I posted a mix with 3 part harmonies... in spite of having a plugged ear, I recorded a middle harmony. It sounds like there's a lot of reverb on this right now but it's hard to say with one ear...


:-(


I'll mix this better (and do some keys when this ear gets better. I have a doctor appointment.

Keeper said...

dbuck said...
key of F#m
Basic structure is F#m - A - D - F#m
Chorus structure is B - D - A - F#

December 14, 2007 2:49 PM

___________________________________

Don have a listen to IB_Chords mp3. I used the chords you gave here. It doesn't feel right to me on the chorus. The B doesn't sound right. I also used F#m on the last of the chorus rather than F# as you gave. I'm going to try a B flat on the first chord.

Keeper said...

Ok I think the chorus should be Bm - D - A - F#m

See what you think of that. I'll try a mix with those chords and see what you think. it feels better with Bm rather than the B.

Keeper said...

Ik the IB_new_chords.mp3 is a mix with my suggested chords. Feels much better to me. That's what I'm gonna use then. The piano part you hear is close to what I'll use, except certain chords will be sustained for the phrase. I can do this easy enough with midi parameters...

dbuck said...

I guess I should clear this up. I gave you a rough draft of the chords off the top of my head.
It is in the key of F#
Basic structure is F# - A - D - F#
Chorus structure is Bm - D - A - F#m
Intro is the F#m - A - Asus5addD - F#m.

dbuck said...

Note the F#'s in the main structure are minor, but I play 5ths for the solo. so this leaves it open for the feel.

dbuck said...

I really didnt hear a difference. If you are saying B#m as posted on your download. I'm sorry there is no b#m. A b#m would be Cm. Your confusing me keep. Some notes will work with with other notes, so if your on to something let me know.

Keeper said...

No read the posts Don. You called the first chord of the chorus a B. B doesn't work. Bm works.

You don't hear a difference in the frist chord of the chorus in those excerpts? I guess it doesn't matter, because I used a Bm in my latest and it fit fine now.

Keeper said...

This is what I'm talking about Don. The B you wrote should be a Bm.

It's working now that I found the right chords...

http://fjamstudios.blogspot.com/2007/12/its-better-rock-keys-lead-guitar.html#c9127585934401295737

I hear a big difference in the last two mixes. No worries...

Keeper said...

Ok listen to IB_mix12_19.mp3. it has some of my keyboard ideas in it. It's a rough mix, with one bad ear... If this flies, I'll mix it when I'm well. I have a few more tweaks to do too, but most of it is done I think... Pending what you all say about it...

dbuck said...

sorry for the typo bro. mabey you can correct it so we dont confuse people.
Myself I can tell the diff from a major and a minor. But I guess your right, some people may not.

Keeper said...

Yeah shit happens Don. It's no biggie. Just wanted to let you know I changed the chords in a few places... I got it worked out so there's no problem....


I'm a little worried you didn't hear any difference in the mixes (as you said), but that's not even a problem. As long as I do that's all I'm worried about..

Did you listen to my mix?

I just corrected where the high harmony got loud after the leads. I saw what happened... Working in a hurry. Got it all straight now..

Keeper said...

LOL I just noticed that my dog Libby is on the end of that last mix... Shes was raising hell while I was trying to record the middle harmony the other day. I'll have to put her on the credits...

Keeper said...

IB_mix12_20.mp3


New mix posted. I have some ideas for more improvised vocals after the leads. A "call & response" type lead vocal. Once my ear clears up I'll give it a go.

Keeper said...

Today's mix has tubular bells added to the middle. Except for a place on the end where I edited Don's guitar to make it sustain and the edit pops, I'm pretty happy with this. All it lacks is the adlib vocal and the song could be complete..

Keeper said...

Don-

WOuld you be willing to do a few key phrases to make this smoother? I have the idea put together with editing, but it'd be much smoother if you did the same thing without the edits. Mostly because I've had to splice sections together to make them sustain and the parts are different volumes so it jumps. It's most evident where is sustains and releases into a fade. Like on the very end of the song. If youlosten to the end note I have you playing it sustains, but you can hear a sort of pop in it, where the parts I put together have different volumes (on the last mix I posted). I think with a bit of work I could fix it and use what I have, but it'd be much easier just to have you play that and let it sustain and release naturally. If you played that last note and let it fade naturally I could use it in there and it'd be smoother. TIA

Wages said...

Hi, this is my first attempt at using F-Jam. Keeper suggested I audition vocals for this track. Since I've never used F-Jam, can you tell me what I need to do? I assume I need to record demo vocals as a separate track and upload it using the audition button. Any special instructions?

F-Jam Alert said...

Wages said...
Hi, this is my first attempt at using F-Jam. Keeper suggested I audition vocals for this track. Since I've never used F-Jam, can you tell me what I need to do? I assume I need to record demo vocals as a separate track and upload it using the audition button. Any special instructions?

January 3, 2008 10:47 AM

________________________________

I assume Richard knows what he wants so I'll let him address your questions. I can make a minus vocal mix for ya.


Here are the lyrics


(Revised version)

It's better to say nothing, and to get it right
It's better to be silent, than to start a fight

I don't want to be misunderstood, by my good intentions
It's better to be careful, and forget to write

Chorus

I'm not so ignorant
I can admit when I'm wrong
I'm not too blind
To see what's going on

(solo) Sometimes you just gotta think, and not put your heart on the line

It's better not to question, what is going on
Sometimes it's less stressful, to just let things roll

It's better to be peaceful, and to dream it's right
It's better to acquire taste for the good things in life

Chorus

Repeat vesrses 1 & 2

breakfree74 said...

Hey chaps...I just got back from up the line (no rest for the wicked as they say) and have only just seen Wages note there.

Firstly Wages have you got anything that we can listen to online?

My thought was that the existing vocals melody wise are fine, it could just do with some roughing around the edges is all, rather than sounding too straight if you get what i mean? No disrespect to ya at all Keeper...a raspy/ballsy vocal thrown in with what's already down would be what i woulda thought...of course it would be up to Don to agree on any changes in the vocal slot too.

cheers
Richard

breakfree74 said...

I see wages fell off the bandwagon on this one ?

Keeper said...

I don't think Wages was ever really part of it. Couldn't get past square one with him.

breakfree74 said...

sorry to hear that, but i trust things have been going well with other projects? I certainly hope you've all been well and inspired.

Last i heard from dbuck was that he and his band were entering the studio, maybe they're still there? LOL (Hi to ya Don if you're reading buddy).

Well the good news is that I may have another vocalist interested if theres a possibility of a mix without vocals and just the music?, however ive gotten used to this version and quite like it you'll be pleased to know, but there's no harm in another version is there?

Keeper said...

breakfree check your gmail. There's an invite to join the project blog. If you join, your comments will bypass moderation. We had to add moderation for comments because of spam.

breakfree74 said...

sweet man, have accepted and done the bizzo, cheers for the heads-up :-)

Keeper said...

No harm with me, as author of the melody. Bring your singer on.

I stay busy with projects, always, but it'd be good to see a few of these sinkers gain new life and finish...

breakfree74 said...

I'll get Roy onto singing a version as soon as I can be supplied with an instrumental mix without any vocals on there, however im not sure if he'll be able to subscribe to this site (i will ask him to however).

cheers
Richard

Keeper said...

I'll dig up the project file from my archives and make your voxless mix, in the next day or so.

breakfree74 said...

cheers man, wasnt expecting ya to make it a rush job or anything especially with the holidays coming on (not that im into them), whenever ya can do it is cool, no rush man.

cheers
Richard

Keeper said...

its_better_no_vox_mix

breakfree74 said...

Crikey man, you're no slacker are you??? cheers for that, will fire it on to Roy and see what he thinks :-)

Onya sir !

Keeper said...

Well it doesn't always pay to be quick about it. I just noticed I left my panflute part out of the mix. It's missing right after his guitar lead. If it's going to mess with him I can do it over.

breakfree74 said...

LOL I don't think thats gonna matter too much really, I've got another pal that might wind up adding some really cool Brian May type guitar harmonies in there too just to give things a bit of extra edge :-)

breakfree74 said...

Hey Keeper, is there any chance of you uploading the drums and bass tracks as seperate tracks? we're gonna try something here.

cheers
Richard

breakfree74 said...

oops my bad, have already got the bass track, so if you can hook me up with the drums on their own that'd be good...no keys or anything.

cheers man, most appreciated
Richard

F-Jam Alert said...

Ok. I'll get this today.

Keeper said...

Here's a wav of just the drums Richard. It'll yield the best final mix if you use a wav for your new project.



http://www.4shared.com/file/77276886/6bb2e9a0/its_better_drums.html<-- Click this

breakfree74 said...

Much oblidged Keeper, many thanks, will keep you posted as to how we get on here.

cheers and seasons greets to you (and whoever else might be reading :-)

cheers
Richard

Keeper said...

Leo-

I would have finished this project a long time ago, but as you know my voice gave out. I wanted to fix some of the guitar work too but the guitarist (actually the writer of the rythm), stopped responding.

This sort of thing is one reason I developed the ability to do guitar parts myself. I am the author of the melody, which is actually one of the copyrightable parts. So a huge part of this track belongs to me. I am one of it's owners, along with the lyricist.

I can fix the guitar myself and no longer need Don to respond. But the vocals I am stuck on. I am doing all of the singing in this track, and I wrote the melody, among other things. There is some adlib vocals on the end that I need to have in order to finish this one. I can show you want I want. Maybe down the road you can sing some adlib for me?

I am patiently waiting for this medication to bring my voice back. If I had it I could finish this all myself and it wouldn't matter if they stopped responding or not.

Interested in helping me finish this one later?

breakfree74 said...

Keeper, the last i heard from Don was that he was looking at getting his band to record a version of this track, which i assumed would be fine - as a co-writer i think he has as much right as anyone to record his own version if he chooses to. However feel free to go forth and complete this version, i'll be interested in hearing how it pans out.

Sadly the guy I had sorted out for singing on this track got tied up with a backlog of other material so hasnt gotten to it.

cheers

Richard

Keeper said...

Chords are not copyrightable. That is what Don did. He wrote the rythm. What is copyrightable is the lyrics and the melody. That is you and I.

It really doesn't matter, because I don't care how Don uses the song. He has my blessing. He stopped responding here after i corrected the chords he said to use.

This version is almost finished. Just some adlibs at the end and I'd be done. I have the guitar covered that I asked Don to help me get fixed so it doesn't matter that he went silent. If I have to wait for my voice to come back that'll be ok too.

breakfree74 said...

I'm cool with whatever, as long as it sounds good :-)

I hope ya voice isnt causing you too much grief and that you're back on the road to recovery real soon dude.

Who's the Leo dude you mentioned in your previous message?


cheers
Richard

Keeper said...

Leo is a singer/songwriter from Brazil I've been working with here on the F-Jam site. He has a whole cd worth of music he wants to produce. He has posted a couple and we are working on them. First two songs on the QUICKSTART list are Leo's. He's also working with me on one of Ed & Phil's rockers. Actually Leo has been doing quite a bit of auditioning for other people's songs... Mostly people who don't know it because they disappeared. It's good that Leo is working on his own tunes for the most part.

breakfree74 said...

Sounds cool i'll have to check his stuff out - if he's in need of a hand with anything lyrically then i might be able to lend a hand if required.

Keeper said...

Yeah it makes it hard to meet new people when you are only subscribed to your own projects. Leo has been quite active here for about 6 months. He is Brazilian so he does indeed need lyric help quite often.

I've written a 2nd verse for his song "Lights In Fantasy", for lyrics, as well as helping him with bass & drums. I have it written but I haven't shown it to him yet. So I suppose it's still open as to who writes the 2nd verse.

There has actually been quite a bit of activity happening here i guess you were unaware of because of your subscription setting.

You might as well say I am a non-vocalist right now, but I am hopeful the medicine will bring it back...


Take care...

breakfree74 said...

My apologies for not being around more but my band endeavours have meant my attention has been pretty much focussed on completing our
2nd album - which is a done deal and sounding better than i imagined :-)

Well if you've already written something then far be it for anyone else to muscle in dude. I'll have a nosey around and see if theres anything that tickles my fancy as i have the time :-), from what i heard Leo has a good voice so it'd be cool.

cheers
Richard

Keeper said...

We sent out a Mass invitation to the lyricist's talent group. Guess you aren't subscribed. If you were it'd come to you.

Take care now. back to the console for me...

1oneleo said...

Sure I can help! It´s the first time I hear your voice...this song is calm, cool Fred!
I think this weekend I´m free to record again... I finished my compromises with...job, girlfriend, family... now is my weekend finaly!